To POLITICIANS and the LAME STREAM MEDIA – Letter to the Editor
POLITICIANS and the LAME STREAM MEDIA
disgrace themselves by co-opting a eulogy to advance their political agendas, crocodile tears and all. It’s abhorrent and obviously that they have no shame. Let Newtown, Conn. mourn in peace. Please!
R. Fall
Madison, FL.
@Laura,
Please excuse my remiss in responding. I really never figured anyone would read an article I posted about a man who we all know, who struggled with the demon of gun ownership. In the end he decided not to own a gun. MLK discusses, credits, and practices Ghandi, but real students of civil rights movement across the world are aware of an earlier influence, Leo Tolstoy.
In regard to your question, How did I feel after reading the article, please allow me to link another recent article which expresses my thoughts more eloquently than I. http://www.truthdig.com/report/item/a_time_for_sublime_madness_20130120/
“That God could “make a way out of no way” in Jesus’ cross was truly absurd to the intellect, yet profoundly real in the souls of black folk. Enslaved blacks who first heard the gospel message seized on the power of the cross. Christ crucified manifested God’s loving and liberating presence in the contradictions of black life—that transcendent presence in the lives of black Christians that empowered them to believe that ultimately, in God’s eschatological future, they would not be defeated by the “troubles of this world,” no matter how great and painful their suffering. Believing this paradox, this absurd claim of faith, was only possible in humility and repentance. There was no place for the proud and the mighty, for people who think that God called them to rule over others. The cross was God’s critique of power—white power—with powerless love, snatching victory out of defeat.” Cone
@ rust That was an awesome article. Thank you so much for sharing!
How did you feel after you read it?
http://mlk-kpp01.stanford.edu/index.php/kingpapers/article/chapter_8_the_violence_of_desperate_men/
L.N. -hate to break the news to you, but it’s not about what could happen, but instead what has been happening in government for many many years. This country was founded upon certain principles, which have been undermined and compromised, and continue to be. Here a little for you L.N., just because you don’t know, have never heard, don’t understand, or cannot comprehend, doesn’t mean it never happened, or isn’t happening (you’re fantasy world). If you don’t agree with those principles the founding fathers of this crafted the Dec. of Ind. and the Constitution upon, you are more than welcome to pack up and go back where you came from. There are many opinions, but only one truth, and one reality. Your assertions otherwise serve as the indictment of a worldview in conflict with an antithetical one, and in effect, the enemy of Christianity.
L.N. , to start with the true assault weapon is selective fire which means there is a switch on the receiver that one turns that takes the firearm from semi auto ( one round fired for each trigger squeeze ) to full auto . Very few people own assault weapons . I do not own one . I also do not own a pistol that takes a 10 round clip magazine or more depending on model . What you & others want to do is outlaw semi auto firearms . More than a decade ago Gov. Gray Davis ( Democrat ) & the California Democrat controlled legislature passed their own “assault weapons ” ban as well as outlawing many other classes of firearms . There was a several month period for those listed to be turned in . Very few , I believe less than 400 statewide , were turned in . So now technically the hundreds of thousands that did not comply are felons . Some moved to other states . Neither Schwarzenneger nor Brown so far have pushed the issue . Now New York state with Cuomo has passed their version , their listed firearms are to be registered with the police & when the owner passes they are to be turned in to the state . I doubt many will be turned in . In my view what we have are liberal & socialist Democrat politicians that are mouthy but do not have the stones to enforce their own laws which to gain compliance they would have to order their constabulatory to start breaking in doors & conficating & arresting people .
As to the term militia , the militia is regular armed citizens , not U.S. armed forces or national guard . In times of historical or constitutional crisis they have picked up their rifle & pistol , faced the challenge or battle & when it was over went back home . They do not have a contracted term of duty . I had distant relatives that fought as militia in the Civil War . They left their farms & timber camps , fought & when the battle was over they went home . The word militia is widely unknown to most people or misunderstood & thought of as national guard which is wrong .
Thanks, Laura. I have in the past on different things, and called, but at best all they do is send a form letter if they agree and nothing if they don’t. The form letter is often just advertising what they have done, not a response. My views are not well represented. The person who should be listening is, thanks to Republican gerrymandering, in Jacksonville. How much of a chance do you think that someone like that would even care what all of Madison County says about anything at all with the whole of the Jacksonville constituency behind him?
Thing is, I occupy the middle ground on most things. I think people should keep their hunting rifles and the hand guns they have for protection. I don’t hunt and I don’t have a handgun. But that doesn’t mean I want to take yours. Yes, there will still be crime because as long as guns are available, people will use them to commit crimes. But there is no reasonable present in which there is any need for ordinary, untrained citizens to have these weapons and means of massacre. Anyone who really listens knows that is what is being advocated, not “taking our guns.” Even Heston, when he spoke those famous words, was holding up a rifle, not a military assault weapon.
KP? In what sense does your plan fall into either a “well ordered militia” or “provid(ing) for the COMMON defense?” Unless you can figure that one out, no amendment change necessary.
Purveyor? There you go again (to quote your hero). Would that be the truth or “the truth according to Purveyor?” The people who are being manipulated are the ones living in their fantasy where the truth is whatever they think it is going to be someday if things turn out the way they think even though they have no real evidence…. It’s easier.
@ L.N. – Do you write to the politicians? You would be good at it.
L.N. , you have that right for a change , our differences are not reconcilable . One thing I can tell you , I will never be found on someones private property taking what is theirs . On the Bill of Rights , for me , there is no compromise . If one wants to change it , go through the amendment process .
The murder of twenty children does indeed say much, but the question is, what? The appropriate response is far from a foregone conclussion. The truth is, politics in our age is largely a game of perception, one in which the mass media purposes to manipulate that public perception, to the benefit its “progressive” agenda. Sandy Hook happened, and similar events will happen again, unfortunately, regardless of whatever measures are taken. I’m not sure what’s worse, the fact that we have leaders willing to politicize these tragedies to forward partisan legislation, or the fact that so many are susceptible to their machinations.
KP, maybe another similar thread in which someone challenged me by asking if I was going to “come and take my guns.” That I interpreted to mean, just you try it sistah. When I confronted the possibility of the only slightly veiled threat,,it was not retracted or denied. Instead, a pivot to a statement supporting the second amendment.
So sorry. Anyone who would think in terms of such a threat is way beyond rational discussion.
Well, if that is a good paradigm, apply it to the Patriot Act which was the greatest intrusion into the lives of private citizens since McCarthy. Or apply it to the fact that all your children’s teachers must submit to fingerprinting without probable cause or lose their jobs and that public employees must submit to random drug tests without probable cause and that the Florida Legislature tried to pass a Law saying that all recipients of public assistance should be randomly tested for drugs without, again, probable cause.
What? No fear? No outrage? No threats of rebellion or violence? Why ever not?
In the meanwhile, I would explain that the paradigm operates on an erroneous premise: the premise that everyone needs the government to point out that there is a problem so as to “provide the solution.” Unless one believes that all these stories about mass murders perpetrated by people who have access to inappropriate kinds of weapons (in which case one would also be beyond hope), the problem is there for all to see. I don’t think any objective observer would need that kind of “guidance.” I am sure that I don’t. The massacre of 20 children under the age of seven by one such person says so, along with a disturbing proliferation of such events. I don’t care in this case what the government says as they are not saying anything I do not know from my own observation.
You want a government to be afraid of? Look to your state legislature.
Let “someday” and “what if” give place to “now” and “what is,”
How the “Problem-Reaction-Solution” Paradigm works:
1. The government creates or exploits a problem then attributes blame to others.
2. The populace reacts by asking the government for protection and help to solve the problem.
3. The government offers the solution that was planned by them long before the crisis occured.
Outcome: Rights and liberties are exchanged for the illusion of protection and help.
L.N. , I have seen no one threaten violence against you on this site nor should they . I have seen nothing posted where someone has said they are coming to your residence to confront you or do you harm nor should they . Now if you go to someones residence looking for trouble , that is on you . This statement looks awfully dramatic to me .
You’re right. What was I thinking posting that fueled by paranoia, fear induced, crazy, panic invoking, lousy excuse for literature? There ought to be a law..
Because it is off the deep end paranoid, Laura, and because I have learned that a person cannot swallow whole everything he reads on the Internet. It is a huge game here of “gossip” without even the social controls that exist when the person starting the rumor has to do it face to face.. And because I have seen people in this thread threaten violence against me and people like me so that they can keep not their hunting rifles and handguns they may have for protection but their military style weapons capable of killing a person every second because they are afraid of some “what if.” Although I do think that Ben Stewart went way too far to put a gun to the head of an unarmed old man over a bunch of cats as he is alleged to have done, by and large, the government leaves a law abiding citizen like me and everyone i know alone. It has been that way my whole life, and I don’t have any realistic cause to think that will change.
Google the two incidents I mentioned. It may help you understand. (And I wouldn’t say that if I didn’t also remember the events.) Those people endured willingly all kinds of abuse by their leaders because their leaders brainwashed them to believe the government was out to get them when the government, if it had any interest in them at all, was trying to rescue them from those dangerous abusive situations. Then again, victims of paranoia have difficulty recognizing it.
Hope that helps, though.
Don’t have time to look at another similar link. Sorry.
Why do you feel this point of view would incite fear or provoke violent action?
How bout this..you gotta find this interesting:
http://i.plikomat.pl/media/i/023659b72f06326a7374b37e03ae6274.jpg
No permit needed!!
I don’t really find unreasonable fear intended to incite a violent response “interesting,” Laura. This is Branch Davidian Jim Jones koolaid stuff. Sorry.
Interesting.
https://www.facebook.com/#!/photo.php?fbid=318208364962218&set=pb.114896831960040.-2207520000.1358126508&type=3&theater
The government is not killing children.
I know you believe your fearful argument, but it is objectively not real. I don’t think it isn’t real. It really, really isn’t..
Trying to convince someone who is living a fantasy when real innocent people are dying is pointless. You just have to make the law and enforce it.
Don’t know if links are permitted in these postings, but here is one that I agree with 100%. I have kids in elementary school as well as a spouse who teaches at an elementary school and would love to see us utilize the history and statistics that show us we are safer with legal, law abiding, gun toting citizens in our presence whether it be at a school, hospital, movie theater, etc.
Also, if you look at the news reports available on the internet, it appears that the shooter at the Portland, OR mall who luckily only took two lives shot himself after being confronted by a citizen who drew his legally carried concealed weapon.
http://m.usatoday.com/article/news/1791085?articlePage=0
L. N. , I think you underestimate the effectiveness of armed citizens . Consider the whiskery crew that live in the rural areas of Afghanistan . Our military has engaged these folks with air strikes , artillery fire & men on the ground yet they are still there . When we pull out for the most part in 2014 they will still be a fighting force & I suspect the Taliban will take back control of that country . Just about all they have are rifles & booby traps .
The military has tanks and bombs, also. We need to get real. It isn’t the military that is killing children. People who make that argument are living in the paranoid fantasy that they could prevent the military with a defense budget of billions of dollars from doing whatever it wanted with a few guns. Meanwhile, children are being killed by private citizens with guns they have because of the paranoid fantasy.
I still have not heard a really good real world argument.
@ george yeah your right george YOU GOTTA LOVE THE GUY i personally would love the guy to resign,love the guy to be a real president,or love for him to take some “HOW TO BE A PRESIDENT AND NOT RUIN YOUR COUNTRY” president classes from some other presidents whose plans actually worked so yep ya gotta love the guy
Dan, ya got me,
Obama has been voted the 4th best president ever.
I was just reading that after less than 4 years,
Obama has been rated the 4th best president ever:
I have never seen that happen before.
Reagan and only 9 others tied for first,
15 other presidents tied for second,
and a mere 18 other presidents tied for third.
Obama came in fourth. Ya gotta love the guy.
@ Eddie
Sir! Am I proud of selling firearms? Eddie my answer is, Yes. I am very proud of having the opportunity to prevent the murder of a young lady in Tallahassee whose father had been raping her from the time she was fourteen years old. Also the wife of a brutal husband who promised to kill her when he got out of jail in two months after being given four years for aggravated assault on her body. I’m proud of supplying many of our Law Enforcement personnel here in Madison with the firearms that protect all of our lives.
I will never forget the day when one of our Deputies told me “they only had handguns to face a criminal that had an SKS and possibly an AK-47”. That problem stopped Eddie that same day. I built several firearms for both our Sheriff and Police Department. Eddie that enabled both of these LE departments to better defend all of us from the bad guys.
I’m proud of building firearms for other LE departments in the State of Florida, protecting all of us in the State including you Eddie. I’m proud of supplying a 22-year-old 90-pound mother of a child she brought to life even after being raped repeatedly and finally bringing that piece of crap to his demise. The young lady still has nightmares of repeated assaults on her my firearm stopped that problem
Eddie, with my firearms I can make any female equivalent to a much larger attacker anytime.
Eddie, what is it that you do to protect us? Well other than complain of any conservative thought? God Bless you and Merry Christmas
George
ok guy’s let’s try a truthfull statement.I know it’s hurts.
Obama: I Have Expanded Rights of Gun Owners
Two months after the January 2011 Tucson shooting, President Obama put into writing the same pledge he made last night in Newtown, Conn. “We have a responsibility to do everything we can to put a stop to” tragedies from gun violence, he said in an op-ed in the Arizona Star.
But in the next sentence, Obama adds this caveat, shedding light on his approach to guns:
“Like the majority of Americans, I believe that the Second Amendment guarantees an individual right to bear arms,” he wrote. “And, in fact, my administration has not curtailed the rights of gun owners — it has expanded them.”
In his first month in office, Obama overturned a 20-year ban on loaded guns in national parks and wildlife refuges. Licensed gun owners from any state can now carry concealed, loaded weapons on federal land.
Ten months later, as part of an omnibus spending bill, Obama reversed a decade-long ban on transporting firearms by train. Amtrak travelers can now carry unloaded, locked weapons in their checked baggage.
These actions, and others, are what earned Obama an “F” from the Brady Center for Gun Violence in 2010 for “extraordinary silence and passivity” on gun control. But Obama saw the moves differently.
“The fact is, almost all gun owners in America are highly responsible,” Obama wrote in the Star. “They’re our friends and neighbors. They buy their guns legally and use them safely, whether for hunting or target shooting, collection or protection. And that’s something that gun-safety advocates need to accept.”
This outlook offers insight into how the administration will approach what Obama described as the need for “meaningful action” in the aftermath of the Newtown massacre last week.
As president, Obama has always emphasized the need to keep guns out of the wrong hands, rather than restrict the availability of guns or gun parts themselves. In his few public comments on the issue as president, Obama has called for enforcement of existing laws and improvements to the national background check system.
The background check system “hasn’t been properly implemented. It relies on data supplied by states – but that data is often incomplete and inadequate,” Obama wrote in his March 2011 op-ed. “We should in fact reward the states that provide the best data – and therefore do the most to protect our citizens… we should make the system faster and nimbler.
“We should provide an instant, accurate, comprehensive and consistent system for background checks to sellers who want to do the right thing, and make sure that criminals can’t escape it,” he wrote.
Experts say that beefing up the system — and improving its ability to catch mental illness among potential gun buyers — is something that Obama could do right away via executive order. One proposal includes directing more state or federal agencies with knowledge of a person’s mental competency or drug use to funnel that information into one, central background check system.
Other gun control proposals that Obama has endorsed, such as requiring background checks for gun sales at trade shows or banning the sale of assault weapons, would require Congressional approval. In spite of six major shootings on his watch, Obama has not publicly pushed for a renewal of an assault weapons ban or new restrictions on high-capacity magazines.
@ purveyor i didnt understand a thing you said the whole time ! i gotta say with all due respect and remember im saying with all due respect that idea aint worth a velvet painting of a whale and a dolphin gettin %% 0#!!!
@ george
Interesting that the first news reports out of Newtown that I saw clearly indicated that the Postmaster was left IN THE VEHICLE. Sounds like someone has an agenda. Today the media is of accusing the NRA of being insensitive, and driven by absolutist doctrine (ie. “obstructionist”). How is it that the NRA is insensitive to Newtown, while the administration pimps the victims and families?
I feel your pain, George.
These must be really trying times for arms dealers such as yourself. Fortunately, you have the ARA on your side spouting the mantra, “More guns are the solution” for you. Now all they need are a population of fools and idiots who will subscribe to such nonsense.
@ j. kinard yeah that tends to happen but im sure the editor wouldnt approve comments unless he wanted them posted on his site HA HA HA thanks for the concern though !!!
My heart goes out to the families in Newtown Connecticut that lost their loved ones, those beautiful children had their complete future ahead of them and a madman took that away. The Media and many people now blame the firearm for the death of these children especially a firearm now called an “Assault Rifle” pertaining to an AR-15 or clone and or an AK-47.
Both of these firearms are popular among all walks of life, however they are not Assault Rifles. A real Assault Rifle has the capability of becoming a full-auto firearm with a mere flick of a switch. I happen to know a little something about this subject as I build these real Assault Rifles for Police and other Government agencies. For a civilian to own a real Assault Rifle, one must get the Sheriff to sign off on a form four, that is if you have a real Sheriff and not a politician, get finger printed, have a mug shot taken, give the Government $200.00 for a Tax Stamp then wait six months before taking possession of that Assault Firearm. The cost of these firearms, are prohibitive for most people starting at $4000.00 to as high as $225,000.00.
Two weeks after the election I met three Federal Officers all three told me the same thing. “I have the paperwork on my desk, Obama will ban many firearms with detachable magazines by Executive Order.” When asked if they would be picking them up (Firearms) I was told, “that would be committing suicide for their officers and most would resign their post”. Neither would elaborate any further though one mentioned that the UN would have to do something like that.
There is now a rumor that the AR-15 was not used in this murderous act, and that the two handguns he carried were the only weapons used. It matters not what weapons were used the children are gone. Will the banning of firearms stop killings? Of course not, most thinking people know that we have been killing one another since we figured out how to sharpen a stick. Most of us will never think “I’m going out and kill someone today” but some people do and they will do that deed no matter what laws are passed. If I had my druthers, I would rather be able to defend myself then wait for a police officer to come to my rescue.
Whatever happens in the next few months, firearms certainly will be sold in great numbers. From 12:09PM the first firearm I sold, to 4:26PM the last firearm I sold on 12/21/2012, nearly 5000 firearms were sold here in Florida.
Do we need firearms? For most of us in the firearms culture it’s never been about need. We don’t need a wife but most of us have one, we don’t need an automobile but most of us have at least one. It’s about want. ”I work many hours a day and what I do with my money is my business only”. I hear that every day. What really galls me is that the people wanting to remove our 2nd amendment all have armed guards why is that?
Stay Safe and have a Merry Christmas
George
Everybody is way off topic?????
Mr. Cretin,
I am pretty simple and also pretty educated. Can’t understand your last post. Remember, this is Madison, FL
@ rube –
In a nutshell, the liberals are in fact using this awful tradgedy to forward their agenda of more government regulation. This type of regulation does not, and will not prevent crime. I have already said that 22 kids were murdered in China, in a school, on the same day, with a knife. Desperate people find a way. Liberals believe the state should play a larger role in parenting its citizens; conservatives reject this notion as un-constitutional, because it is. However, things are just not as simple as the conservatives would like them to be. For instance, in economic circles, Romney’s campaign pushed more “trickle down economics” to solve the country’s financial crisis. True, free market capitalism DOES work that way, PROVIDED those who buy and sell conduct their business with self-imposed ethics, where all in the economy participate in a fair playing field. This obviously has not been the case for many years. As a result, immoral business practices and greed has perverted the free market system. When this happens, the people cry “injustice”, and I understand why. Who is going to fix things? I can tell you, that the liberals are right there to point out that more regulation is needed to “protect” the people. More regulation, less freedom. Had Romney gotten elected, we would have had four more years of the same greed and corruption, with the liberals pushing for more control. Originally, the founding fathers wrote a document, the Constitution, to prevent the state (government), from over-stepping its bounds. At the time, it was a far more simple life, with most people doing a much better job of governing themselves, and applying faith, morals, and ethics to all spheres of their lives. Today, society is out of control. We have no direction, and the only moral is to look out for #1. This has produced a list of problems so long I can’t write it here, but sufficed to say, people are looking to the government to institute more controls, to prevent some of the growing problems. Much of this legislation is un-Constitutional, as conservatives would point out, but the same conservatives are just as guilty, often times more guilty, of the behaviors and practices that have caused the “old ways” to fail. They are quick to point out how big governement is fundamentally wrong, but slow to lift a finger to take personal responsibility for their part of problem. You just can’t have your cake and eat it.
@the purveyor,
Somehow I think you got something to say. But, remember you are talking to cretins and rubes. Please, no more riddles or legal talk. Now is not the time for phatic communication.
We need dialectic.
I know dialectic is a learned skill, but not a particularly difficult one, either. ” Anyone who can tell the difference between a fact and an opinion, recognize a dozen or so of the standard logical fallacies, follow an argument step by step from its premises to its conclusion, and forbear from dragging the discussion down to the level of personal slurs, can pick it up promptly given a competent teacher and a little practice.”
I am interested in what you have to say, but frankly do not understand what the hell you are talking about. Clue. Rube. Cretin.
You got something to say. Bring it down to a level of the the rubes and cretins.
Thank you.
Eddie , good hearing from you . Unless you can help me out a move such as that takes time . You see , I do not live in taxpayer funded housing so I Just can’t pack up & leave . Those on the federal dole should pack up & leave to go where there is work but they do not have to . I have a house to sell plus a separate tract of timber land . If you have several hundred thousand dollars available you could be a great help in my endeavor . Perhaps you can obtain Obama dollars for this investment . One time I applied for federal grant money to upgrade my house : I was turned down & told you have pensions , interest & dividend income , this program is not for you , it is for those that don’t . I said I worked for those things , in fact worked two jobs in my 40′s . Eddie , you are right , we are just from different mindsets & neither one is going to change . Heard Eric Holder on news today : he said Obama will institute or augment gun control by executive orders if Congress does not pass something he considers adequate . As an older guy I find that concept frightening for the future . To me , that is dictatorship . Maybe Texas & Oklahoma will secede .
Trapper. You make some good points. Also, I think if everyone will research the numbers, since 2006 gun related murders have decreased every year with a corresponding increase every year in gun purchases. Somebody besides me may want to do the research, but this is what I have found. Also, my understanding that with around 12,000+/- gun murders last year approximately 300 were committed with assault type weapons. I do not intend to take away from the horrible tragedies of lately with the mass shootings; however, I hope that we will focus also on the proactive defense that should be taken by law abiding citizens that legally own firearms of all types. I think that in our politically correct society we live in we now see what used to be known as “evil” as “mental illness” and there is not any psychologist or psychiatrist that will be able to determine who may and who may not commit such a horrible crime.
We builit the country since winning the revolutionary war to be the greatest power in the world in what is a relatively small amount of time compared to other countries. Perhaps the fact that we stuck to the Second Amendment has been part of the reason of this success as there is not one country in the world with the flexible gun laws making ownership of various weapons available to law abiding citizens.
@Knottypine:
Glad to hear that you continue to contemplate your relocation to Texas. It will be a perfect match for you. I am certain that you will be filled with joy in Rick Perry’s homeland. (I understand that Rick Scott may be following close behind…after Charlie Christ helps to fire him.)
Personally, I “kinda” like it here. Certainly, there are many good people in MA and NJ, as you alluded. It is not necessary to travel long distances to find such folks, though. They, (those progressive-leaning folks for whom you hold so much disdain), are right here. Your generation reared them; they are the generation of your children and grand-children.
That’s why the Republican Party has found itself in such a mess. The generation that constitutes the majority of your party woke up after the election and realized that they had grown old. So old that, even with their crafty voter suppression efforts, they can no longer carry the majority or steal an election.
Nevertheless, there’s a U-Haul rental place on US 90, near the Macedonia Church. If you check online, you can get yourself a coupon. Say, “Hi”, to Rick for me. He’s a heck of a guy.
While everyone is busy sniping, how about addressing a REAL problem? Namely, the 60,000 or so people – including 6 year olds – that get wacked on the highways every year. These number make the gun deaths pale by comparison. And – now be honest – most of the gun deaths are gang bangers shooting each other. Does anyone really care that there is one less thug on the streets? The car manufacturers produce these vehicles of death, people do not use them responsibly and disaster soon follows. Lets hold Ford and Chevy responsible for their irresponsibility! They make cars that do 120 mph in a nation where the limit is 70mph. If that is not actionable, I don’t know what is! Just look at the Robert Champion case – you know – the one where the 26 year old man let his friends beat him to death and now his parents are suing the bus company! What a great country! Lets deal with some real issues before attacking peoples right to guns. And be nice now, rube, Seven Bridges is one of the scenic spots in the county, and it is a real shame that the Chamber and the Tourist Development Council and some bed tax money is not used to highlight the area in their ridiculous advertising campaigns. Just being the home of Patches ought to make it rank pretty high on the tourist agenda list.
With so much water under the bridge, applying the Constitution to modern US government is difficult at best. The spirit behind the 2nd Amendment is not the one being peddled by the current administration. Taking into consideration the pretenses under which the original document was drafted, and the many other available writings of the founding fathers, the true spirit of the 2nd amendment is self-governent, and protection from the tyranny which threatens it. “Arms” then, may be defined as the armament necessary for a population to defend itself against such threat. In the 21st century, a revolver or single shot .410 does little in the way of this. To take for granted the infinite perpetuity of the self sovereignty we have enjoyed for many years would be ignorant at best. Those who would assert that the Constitution does not apply today in the same way that it did 200 years ago would be correct, but only in that it is largely because the Federal Constitutional Republic that was the United States has been turned into the Nationalist Democracy our founding fathers sought so fervently to prevent. Mass killings are the result of a much more comprehensive degradation of the values the country was founded upon. Being that the general population rejects most of those principles, the only solution in sight is to rely on the state to provide the personal “government” we have failed to exhibit ourselves. The only problem is, more and more, freedom will fall victim.
Eddie , while I am looking into Texas or some such place I think you should be looking at Mass . or New Jersey for your future . Those places fit your big gov’t. & high tax views & big social welfare very well .
@ rube cretin ive read your latesst comment and i have to say i do partially agree for once. you made some sense by saying there was no need to meet with george that is a goog idea all the way around and ill leave that alone .also i would agree that we should all regret the great tragedy we had at the school shooting and we would all be better people to help prevent further tragedys i just dont think they will stop if guns were more controlled.you are also correct that alot more could be solved if we could all sit down on a cypress stump and have a drink and talk it out.that kinda comprimise would surewly be better than all the government mumbo jumbo ill close with saying we all have our own views and in the end we all must stand for what we believe,for our heritage,and for what we believe is right,after all this is the land of the FREE and the home of the brave!!!
@L.N.
Yes. I think it was in 1791 when second amendment was ratified and all there was were muskets. But muskets were all military had either. Is it fair now to allow military and government to have every advanced weapon there is but to not allow citizens to have anything more than rifles with 10 round clips (at beat)? Would be like saying in 1791 that citizens could possess hatchets and nothing more as compared to the military’s muskets.
We are going to “water down” the second amendment until law abiding citizens have no hope if government wanted to take over.
@ rube cretin im glad you commented back and that was cute but im a little confused now.not to familiar with the 7 bridges/aucilla area, but i thought all the 7 bridges bunch got arrested.wasnt there guns,cash,property and possessions seized in that big bust searching for drugs cash and other illegal activity a few months ago. i guess you were not part of that . or…? who knows…? any way, looks like a chance for you to get to know a local gun dealer and a REAL american!!! it is on your table now but not sure how some people do in a real life situation .i can be easy to unwind something you cant reel back in. .have a nice day.enjoy the nice hunting weather while you can still own a gun!!!
@Knottypine:
I thought that you had moved to Texas.
I agree. I have never heard a good or reasonable argument as to why any private citizen needs a military or police style weapon like the ones that are used to commit these massacres. It always boils down to “I want it because I want it.” Well, grown ups realize that no one can have everything they want all the time. The people who wrote the second amendment used single loading muskets, for heaven sake. Do you think things have changed since then?
rube,
I would sit down and ruminate about my comments but I have no idea what that means. Check your statistics available regarding the schools in Texas that allow teachers to carry (if they meet certain qualifications) as well as the statistics of the states that allow concealed carry on college campuses. Looks to me like this has worked pretty well as I am pretty sure that most every mass shooting has been carried out in places that did not allow concealed carry. Thse potential new restrictions are being brought about by our administration and other left of center folks because of the mass shootings so it is not fair to just look at one side of this equation.
All I here from our current administration is that they will address gun laws as well as the current process for providing mental health services. I have heard nothing from our President about the need to hit this problem head on with force and that we are working out procedures to eliminate these crazy folks as quickly as possible by defending ourselves as quickly as possible when something does erupt. No. I do not think teachers should be responsible for our kids safety, but I feel that they have the right to be able to defend themselves and any other innocent person while waiting on law enforcement expecially in schools with no armed security.
@KPine,
Wow! What do you suggest? High Noon! Can we sell tickets? Do we choose weapons before or during the face to face? Will “Stand Your Ground” rules be in effect?
Kpine, you really need to get a grip man. Your post is a perfect example of the stupidity we Cretins have exhibited for ages. Once again, review the bidding. Read Real World’s comment. He was the one suggesting a face to face. Rube suggested his informal office down on the Aucilla where a couple of fellas can sit down on a log, take a sip of the nectar, and talk things out and you have suggested Georges shop which is at an unknown location. This is as it should be. Only idiots would attend such a meeting when the issues have already been identified, positions taken, and no threat of a “cliff” of some sort exists.
Don’t be so dang sensitive, or take things so literally. George has blood on his hands and so do I, which I admitted too in my original post. I’m trying to figure out what I can do to help prevent events like this in the future. Bout, all I have figured out so far is that I really don’t need to be part of an organization that promotes policies which are contrary to my beliefs and floods our communities with weapons designed to kill people not for hunting or varmint control.. I have also come to the conclusion that the solution is not to put more assault weapons or large bullet clips in our society. We do not need more weapons in our schools. My intention is to put a portion of Georges business, out of business. He knows that, I know that, and we don’t need to meet. I will tell you though, I have been known to change my mind if evidence is presented indicating my position is in error. Personally, I have been strongly effected by this tragedy and am committed to do what I can to be part of any effort to prevent future events of this nature.
Rube , saw George this morning , said if you want a face to face , come to his shop . Call first because of holiday schedule .
Counties and cities should put their police and sheriff department headquarters and substations at or contiguous to our schools.
more silly remarks. let’s let it all hang out!
“Behind the Connecticut Massacre
December 17, 2012 10:21 am
Each time there is an outbreak of homicidal mania, whether Columbine, Virginia Tech, or Adam Lanza’s slaughter of twenty eight innocents in Connecticut, the media directs us to stories about gun control and the need for better policing of individuals with mental illnesses.
The larger context—that America is a society brimming over with violence—is entirely lost in the discussion.
Let’s take a look at the forest for a change, shall we:
There are 192 million firearms owned by Americans, more than any other society in the world.Our rate of death from firearms is three times that of France and Canada, fourteen times greater than Ireland, and two hundred and fifty times greater than Japan, where firearms are aggressively controlled.
The U.S. has more prisoners, per capita, than any country on earth—three times more than Cuba, seven times more than Germany—and, indeed, we house twenty-five percent of all the prisoners in the world.
As for media violence, by the time the average American child leaves elementary school, they will have witnessed 8,000 murders and over 100,000 other acts of violence, and, to rub more salt into these open wounds, the U.S. also leads the world in the sale and rental of violent video games.
That litany of statistics comes to us compliments of our gratuitous interpretations of the First and Second Amendments.
But the forest we are talking grows ever larger.
Since World War II, the United States engaged in over fifty military operations abroad killing some four million people (Korea, Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos, Iraq, El Salvador, Nicaragua, Grenada, Panama, the list goes on). If you add in to that total massacres by proxies and surrogates, the number flirts with five million (Indonesia, Chile, Guatemala, and elsewhere).
We are the only country in the world seemingly perpetually at war. In 2011-2012 alone, the United States was killing people in nine different countries: Iraq and Afghanistan with troops, Libya with rockets, Somalia, Pakistan, and Yemen with drones, Honduras with raids against drug cartels, the Philippines with air support against insurgents, and most recently in Kenya as 150 Special forces started their operations. No other country in the world can boast of so many military involvements.
To remedy the horrors we saw in Connecticut should not be limited to screening mentally ill individuals from purchasing Glocks—which is about as far as our craven mainstream media wishes to venture. Instead we need to recognize the massacres of Jonestown, Columbine, Virginia Tech, and Connecticut are merely symptoms of a much more ubiquitous cancer.
To finally address this problem is to begin a long and arduous process of cultivating a culture of peace. Such collective psychotherapy begins by treating the patient on many fronts and in a multi-dimensional way: To forbid the sale of handguns, nationwide; to ration the sale of ammunition; to prohibit the sale of violent toys to children (Greece already does), to aggressively control the sale and access of violent video games to children (Australia, Venezuela, Germany, Switzerland, Sweden, and Brazil already do), and to prohibit the broadcast of violent scenes, explicit or implicit, on network television during family viewing hours, a practice already in effect in many European countries
And, who knows, we might even take it one step further and retreat from our aspirations of empire and global hegemony, close down our military operations, and bring our vast armies and armadas home —over 400,000 Americans at last count stationed in almost 1,000 overseas military bases.
Russia has ten overseas military bases. China none.
So much room to grow!
Imagine if our progressive President, instead of limiting his compassion to the shedding of a tear at a press conference, actually proposed comprehensive and revolutionary changes and legislation that focused not on the symptoms but, at long last, finally started to address the disease itself.”
Jerry Kroth, Ph.D. is an Associate Professor Emeritus from Santa Clara University and the author of Duped! Delusion, denial, and the end of the American Dream, 2012.
My, My, My,
@Trapper,
Yup, Rube is a crack shot. I know my prey. I am patient. I pick my shot carefully, at a range I am certain off a kill. Don’t want to cause any suffering.
Kinda like commenting on the internet. Put out the bait. Pay careful attention to the reactions of the prey. Wait until a situation occurs which appeals to its emotions, put out the bait, and wait for them to walk into the trap. Kind of like hunting during the rut.
Do you really believe the emotions of freedom to “pack” in all situations is going to override the emotion of wanting to protect our children?
@Jaybird,
Need to go back and check but I recall you were one of those wanting to cut the pay and benefits of school teachers. Government workers, you know. Six of these government folks stood between little children and this killer in Newtown, and lost their lives. They were probably members of a teachers union. Suggest you go to the legislature an get a bill passed to abolish teacher unions and require teachers to be trained to shoot to kill.
@Jack,
Love this quote, “Rather be tried by 12 than carried by 6!” If I use it in the future should I attribute it to you? Don’t want to be incorrect in my attributions.
@jj,
Perfect comment. Enough! Bless you.
@keepin my guns,
Please tell me you are not serious. Few have done more to bring about hate than this idiot Ted.
@REAL WORLD ACCURATE,
Congratulations. You win the prize. Down here on the Aucilla, we call your kind “stumpknockers.” Stumpknockers run out, grab the bait, and run under a log. Another prey, same technique to catch em.
Speaking of your friend George, the arms dealer. I do wish you would go back and review the bidding. Several weeks ago he posted a letter to the editor on this site containing racist and other inaccurate information, we now know was copied from other sources, designed to instill fear into our population, in hopes it would lead to gun and ammo sales for his profit.
Sooner or later folks are going to figure out marketing in our nation and how the appeal to our emotions has led to profits for the merchants and poverty both emotionally and literally, for the citizens. George is a fraud, and it is time he was exposed. If he is interested in meeting me, tell him I will be at 7 bridges on the Aucilla anytime he would like.
@Simple man,
Interesting comments. Sit down sometime and really ruminate about them. Do we really want to rely on our teachers for the protection, education, and mentoring of our children? During the past year, most have wanted to cut their salary, reduce their pensions. and extend their working hours. Please!
Rep. Gohmert from Texas, is an idiot!
In closing, folks go on the net and look at the faces of the children slaughtered in this tragedy. We are better than this. Appeals to our emotions, fears, and weaknesses have inoculated our culture with the mechanisms of death and destruction. We can prevent it, but we must get over the emotions and become more rational and realize the insanity driving our culture.
Regarding Rube Cretin and his silly remarks, all I can say is that he must be a crack shot. Most experienced hunters have needed more than one shot from time to time although, certainly, one shot is the ideal. The Newtown thing was very sad, but lot’s of stuff is very sad. Just more fodder for the ridiculous TV stations and ridiculous newspapers to lament and moan about. I particularly liked it when the president had to carefully choreograph that special tear while reading his carefully prepared speech. We ain’t going to have gun control because all our bottom feeding politicians really care about is one item, and that is their re-election. Want to talk about working across the aisle? They all agree that they want to get re-elected so they can continue to help us. No southern or western congressman, particularly the Democrats, will vote for gun control because they know that would be the end of re-election hopes. Which is all they care about.
I agree with real world accurate. But, I would like to add that I think teachers and other school personel should be trained how to use a gun and be allowed to have one availabe to them in the classroom.
Ronnie……. Tell all how you feel. If they disagree, what the hell. Everyone has the right to their opinion just as I have the right own guns. You can bet that if someone comes into (or around) my home and puts me in fear for my life I will shoot them. So will my wife and my sons….. Rather be tried by 12 than carried by 6!
My heart goes out enough said
vote ted nuget for predsident next time and clear up all this mess
TO YOU RUBE CRETIN. we as americans as southerners have the right to keep and bear arms its the american way and our right. i think anyone who believes the killing will stop with smaller clip size is not thinking straight .if your gona kill and your that deranged im sure you can get black market guns ammo and clips any ways..guns dont kill people,people kill people.im pretty sure most things our so called president obama says have alot of runn around and hidden agenda intent and i dont listen to him speek.i have no time for his nonsense garbage that spews from his dumpster.people like you and him are whats ruining our country.ill have my guns and my ammo which i buy from george and my multiple round clips also, cause i have the right to own them{for now}.obama is gona have to come get mine if he wants them and im sure a lot of other people agree.the school shooting was a tragedy and it a bad thing but people do stuff not mechanical things.that would be like saying dont sell cars cause drunks will drive them and kill families.we will keep driving cars im sure . please quit with the bull crap it feels like an obama speech.saying things to make us feel better with no real plan or proof it will work.im a proud nra member and seems like your not so proud why dont you resign from being an nra member?that would suite me fine.so im keepin my guns ,my ammo,my multiple clips,my family jewels and my rights .how bout you rube cretin ,grow a set and tell george face to face how u feel . NO NO im sure youll just tuck tail and runn and tell obama all about it.
@rube cretin,
This was a horrible tragedy. I expect that George P., is staying away from any dialogue right now out of respect as have most every member of congress from the pro-gun side outside of Rep. Gohmert from Texas who stated his thoughts very thoughtfully in my opinion.
The second amendment to the constitution states that “A well regulated milita being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.” I realize that the term arms may need to be limited to certain variants as has been done over the years. Limiting law abiding citizens to guns that are so far less in substance as compared to those used by today’s military would most likely undermine the effectiveness of the second amendment. And to your hunting references, the second amendment has absolutely nothing to do with what may be needed for effective hunting.
We also need a good defense at every school as there is simply no way in this day and time to determine who may make up a mass murderer so we best be prepared to stop the carnage as quick as possible. Maybe we could implement a system that allowed teachers to go to the police academies accross this nation if they wanted and become reserve officers. This being said, they would have to meet the same training and psychological requirements as other officers and then could offer an additional line of defense for our kids who are sitting ducks at many of our schools. Seems like the school system is able to utilize these great volunteer officers at the sporting events and maybe we could transition this to the classroom.
@R. Fall,
Interesting letter to the editor.
Guess you did not agree with the Presidents message last evening to the families and friends of the teachers and little ones who died in this tragic event. I thought it was one of the greatest speeches ever by a president.
Let me guess. You are a member of the NRA and opposed to any 2nd amendment restrictions and this event is leaving you with no explanation for your position, cause trust me, writing to the editor, on this subject, requesting quite, is a dead give away .
Rube is a life member of the NRA. I have never in my life been so ashamed. I deer hunt, but never need more than one shot from my rifle to get the job done. But in my ignorance I have oppossed any restrictions to ownership and possession of any kind of firearm, cause the NRA told me any regulation would lead to loss of all firearm possession. We got one of those here in this county, George Pouliotte. He is an arms dealer. Google his name and become informed. Have you noticed he has not commented since the events in Newtown last friday.
Now that I think about it, why in the hell do we have these military weapons with 30-100 round magazines for sale to every idiot Tom, Dick, and Harry? This 223 Bush Master ain’t used by any deer hunter I know. Like I said above we Madison County hunters pride ourselves in being able to take down a buck with one shot.
Yup, it is time to make these weapons and unreasonable sized clips illegal. What is the hell have we been thinking.
“Through the eyes of a child we must wake up and see ….